Circumstantial Heroes by Gwynnyd
Reviews (18)
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PipMer
· 10 October 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I loved this. Pippin's dialogue with Aragorn is especially thought-provoking; imagine, offering yourself up to be executed along with your comrade. What loyalty; but then again, you can sum up the character of hobbits by commenting on their loyalty to their friends. I also liked how you handled Brithnir; I think his fate was very just.
Well done!
Katherine-The-Crowned
· 30 September 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Nice job. Loved how everyone was portreyed. I did have to laugh at one little bit. "Queen's wing? He needed to do more exploring." I loved that line. Wonderful job!
Elena Tiriel
· 1 September 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Oh, and I forgot to mention: I think Aragorn's decision regarding Brithnír and his cohorts shows wisdom and discretion.
And thank you for the note regarding "scathless". I, too, saw that, and looked it up in my dictionary (which doesn't have it)... but I considered the source and decided that if anyone knows better than I about presumably archaic language, it would be you. LOLOL!
- Barbara
Elena Tiriel
· 31 August 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Hi Gwynnyd!
This is excellent!
I've had very few dealings with servants (um, make that none.... LOL!), but I imagine it would be extremely reassuring to have one such as Hithdol looking out for my interests so diligently!
I like the way you portray Pippin: concerned about Aragorn's safety and Beregond's well-being, acting honorably by taking responsibility for his own actions, and so perceptive....
I wouldn't trust Brithnír as far as I could throw him, either! He just gives me the creeps (which means you did a great job of writing him ;-) )
And the intrigue around how Hithdol set his sights on serving Aragorn, elbowed his way into the top position, and discreetly questioned the Rangers to find out how best to meet Aragorn's er, more personal needs, are fascinating. He is a very interesting character. Another story from his POV would be very welcome.... but, no pressure! ;-)
A fascinating story that I enjoyed reading... thank you!
- Barbara
cathleen
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Absolutely loved this!
Cathleen
Author's reply
Thank you!
RS
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I love it when I see that you've posted! This was a delight!
The characters' subtle movements and slight gestures made them come to life: "Pippin's shoulders slumped.";"Aragorn arched his brows and peered at Pippin over the rim of his glass.";...."Letting the glass hang lightly from his fingers between his knees, Aragorn leaned forward studying.."; "Aragorn rolled the glass in his hand and took a sip."---Just made it more believable as that character (does that make sense?)
I do love the fact that although Pippin and ARagorn are discussing something quite serious, Pippin is getting inebriated and Aragorn is keeping tabs on how many glasses Pippin has downed compared to his "three sips"....Hilarious! And Pippin slurring his words....cracked me up!
I love the authority that Aragorn showed when he said, "I rule Gondor". You can just feel his majesty from that statement. I love the contrast between your OC's; from the cold "robotlike" Brithnir to the loveable "nannylike" and "not afraid to speak his mind" Hithdol.
One more thing: "We asked the Rangers from the North, and they assured us you were discreet and preferred to choose your own partners." "There have been many ladies who wished to join you", "Did we err in turning them away?";... "Which one of his Rangers had had the cheek? --- PRICELESS!!!
I WILL READ THIS OVER AND OVER AGAIN!
PS - I read one of the reviews where the question was asked if you can continue this? Will you?
Anyway, Thanks for this jewel.
RS
Author's reply
I drive my betas crazy because my first drafts are a lot of dialog and very sparse in the detail department, and then I go back, over and over, and do what I call nuancing, trying to get the movements and reactions, and tweaking the dialog, to feel 'right'. I'm so happy to hear the effort is appreciated!
Don't worry, there will be more stories. Please be patient because I write really, really slowly and the ones I'm working on right now are set earlier.
Thanks so much for the nice comments!
utfrog98
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Another reviewer was nearly late for a doctors appointment; I was late for work due to refusing to leave until I finished the story.
I just love stories about the days immediately following the coronation (book or movie verse). There had to be so much going on; so many folk wondering, hoping, trying and scheming. Poor Aragorn also had much to deal with including fatigue, grief, and adjustment issues.
Please continue this story.
Thank you very much!
Author's reply
I certainly have ideas for other stories set right after the coronation, but novels intimidate me so they won't be 'continuations' of this one, they'll be separate stories. Although I do try to keep Gwynnyd!verse consistent, so they could be read chronologically eventually. (I hope the links work. They are all archived here at SoA) Of the ones I've already written, Paying the Price is set about three days later and Hithdol has a cameo in that one. Bare Feet and Beer takes place the next week. Raised Expectations, chapter 12 in my "2006 Yule challenge story is just before Arwen arrives on the scene. One Equal Temper of Heroic Hearts is about 80 years later and The Lap of Time is Arwen after Aragorn's death.
Thank you for your interest and your comments! I'm so sorry I made you late for work.
Author Reply: Sorry the links don't work, and of course, they can't be edited. Oh well.
AM
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Thank you, that was wonderful.
Author's reply
Your welcome! and thank you for the comment.
Author Reply: Can I plead too busy to proofread? and I really wish there was some way I could edit my replies.
You are welcome! You're welcome.
Hangs head and slinks away.
Raksha The Demon
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
This is one of my favorites of your many well-written and enjoyable works. It's certainly a compelling treatment of the issue of the morality of Denethor's servants vs. Beregond; those who blindly obeyed orders for the sake of honor and tradition, and the one who knowingly defied honor and tradition to try to prevent an unspeakable horror. It's a neat twist for Pippin to name himself as Beregond's accomplice and demand to share his fate; but I can see it happening; since of course Beregond had been reluctant to leave his post (a soldier leaving his post during a siege, the mind boggles, only a coward, or someone of enormous strength of character to see that there was a greater need, would have done such a thing) until Pippin came and urged him to save Faramir and hang the rules.
Aragorn's wisdom is very much in play here; he does not wish to punish the servants, but Pippin alerts him to the fact that the servants, in their loyalty, were complicit in Denethor's immolation, and evidently (and this is sickening) are proud of it. I can understand why they obeyed Denethor, up until Gandalf charged in and pulled Faramir away, and tried to get Denethor to turn from his course - why did the one (unnamed in LOTR) servant just stand around with a torch and let Denethor take it to destroy himself? The servant (here the unctuous Brithdir) could have removed himself and the torch.
Aragorn's strongest point to the very smooth-talking Brithdir is that he wants servants who will protect his children - and Denethor's servants did not protect the helpless Faramir from his the horrible end his father ordered. Beregond did, though he risked his life and honor to do so.
I love drunk Pippin's delight that he and Beregond are going to live - an effective contrast with tough, determined Pippin willing to share Beregond's execution.
And of course I love Aragorn's regard for Faramir when he thinks of him, though he doesn't yet know him well (you know I'm a Faramirist!).
One quibble - Aragorn promises Pippin that he will write 'Clemency' on Beregond's indictment before going to bed, but he doesn't do so, he only writes that no action be taken without the King's involvement.
Oh, I also loved the bit where Hithdol (the faithful and very competent servant, who has a good imagination, a mind that goes outside the box instead of being bound by it) brings up the issue of the new King's bed partners, and Aragorn suddenly realizes that it might look odd for him to be seen even by a loyal servant as improperly dressed alone in a room with a drunken hobbit in his bed! Poor Aragorn, he's got to learn to think of PROPRIETY! All these years of attending to people's health and welfare by campfires and on battlefields, etc.; even a gesture of kindness for a comrade and friend can be misunderstood - it's a whole new world for the new King.
My computer has been doing strange things while I've been writing this review, the Post button has been clicking frequently, so I hope this review hasn't self-posted ten times....
Author's reply
I only see the review once, so I think it posted correctly. And thank you very much for such a detailed and thoughtful review.
One quibble - Aragorn promises Pippin that he will write 'Clemency' on Beregond's indictment before going to bed, but he doesn't do so, he only writes that no action be taken without the King's involvement.
I dithered about that, but because Beregond didn't know he was being pardoned until the last second, I thought perhaps that was the main part of his punishment. If 'reprieved' was written all across the indictment, I think it would have been harder to keep it secret. I'm toying with the idea of writing Aragorn and Faramir coming to the agreement on Ithilien someday, so I wanted to leave myself a little more wiggle room. At least Beregond won't be hauled off and executed out of hand.
Poor Aragorn, he's got to learn to think of PROPRIETY! All these years of attending to people's health and welfare by campfires and on battlefields, etc.; even a gesture of kindness for a comrade and friend can be misunderstood - it's a whole new world for the new King.>/i>
I'm sure he had experience with gossip before, but now it is at a whole new level. LOL Previously, if he slept alone, there was no cause for gossip. Now the fact that he does sleep alone is itself cause for gossip. If he'd thought about it all, he probably thought there was a betting pool on which Gondorian ladies were on the fast track to be chosen queen, and any of his Rangers would have given solemn assurance that he was known to be chaste.
I'm so pleased the story is one of your favorites! Thank you.
phyloxena
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
This Is a Great Story. I'm not up to a review it deserves right now, but I absolutely love every bit of it.
Author's reply
Thank you!
ninqwestilmen
· 11 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I have only just discovered your little treasure of tales and so far I've liked what I read. Your knack at turning small, untold stories into poignant moments is indeed commendable. This new tale is too a wonderful story, well etched out, well portrayed, and fits very well into canon. Now to finish reading the rest of your tales...
Oh, and the cheeky ranger was a wonderful touch!
Author's reply
Even if their public face is grim and severe, Aragorn certainly had a sense of humor and a lot of wonderful human moments, so I can believe his Rangers were real men underneath and not above ribbing their Captain sometimes. I can see him saying it very seriously to Hithdol and later cracking up in the barracks when he repeats it, and also hoping it never gets back to Aragorn.
Glad you enjoyed it and thank you for the comments.
Radbooks
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
A wonderful, well told tale, Gwynnyd. I had never considered what might have happened to the servants that had survived that night. I suppose I just assumed they fled and were never seen again, but that doesn't make sense and this is a very plausible scenario. You've always written Aragorn very, very well and I really like Pippin here as well. He's not a child as he's sometimes portrayed, but an adult who sees things very clearly here. Nicely done and a very enjoyable read - I was almost late to a doctor appointment because of this! :)
Author's reply
Thank you.
I'm sure high level, trained servants were in short supply when they had to staff not one, but two major households. Assuming that Denethor's servants didn't follow his example, they must have still been around and used in some capacity.
I'm sorry I almost made you late!
Agape4Gondor
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I love the words you use at the beginning to set a nice picture, i.e., yielding mattress, pillowed on ironed linen, and looped back drapes.
I love when I find a ‘joining’ corridor – you hit it perfectly – they always are filled with fun stuff… “amused, as always, by the stocks of spare goblets, plates, candelabras and other accoutrements that might be called for…”
I loved the capitalized You and Your – just the right inflection for someone who thinks he is above the one he is talking to!
Majordomo – just have a little problem with this word/title/thing – took me out of the story a couple times
*giggles* “so that when I am Thain, I will have all my dependents bowing and scraping the same way…”
This is so sad – as if Pip could do much of anything against a concerted attack against his friend. ‘If I am known to be on guard, nothing will happen.’
This was truly horrifying – ‘He did not do it alone…’ 'Perfect servants' should have had more sense than to follow those orders."
I like this line… though I love Denethor, it is very true. ‘He did not regret that he had Faramir and not Denethor as his Steward and wondered if that made him craven.’
Pippin shows great wisdom here - "Of course you do! Why are they still serving together? If they were scattered, someone would be with them who could curb them."
I found Pip’s ‘recall’ of that night to be beautiful written and horribly lived. ‘Swords dripped blood in the torchlight. Denethor raved of death and slavery, and wept.’
Brave little ‘fool of a Took!’ – “There's nothing for it. You will have to execute me as well."
Oh my! "Were you this theatrically deferential to Denethor…” Excellent rapier thrust, Aragorn!
“When it is my sons who roam this citadel, I must know that those who serve here will protect my House." I think this is my favorite line!
One small qualm - ‘From all I have heard, Denethor slipped slowly into madness.’
From ROTK – ‘No hours so dark had Pippin known, not even in the clutches of the Uruk-hai. It was his duty to wait upon the Lord, and wait he did, forgotten it seemed, standing by the door of the unlit chamber, mastering his own fears as best he could. And as he watched, it seemed to him that Denethor grew old before his eyes, as if something had snapped in his proud will, and his stern mind was overthrown. Grief maybe had wrought it, and remorse. He saw tears on that once tearless face, more unbearable than wrath.’
I know some people think Denethor ‘slipped slowly into madness’ – I do not. I believe these words meant the madness came that night…’And as he watched, it seemed to him that Denethor grew old before his eyes…’
But that is only one qualm in a remarkable tale. Thanks for sharing it.
Author's reply
My goodness! Blushes furiously. I am so pleased that so much of the story resonated with you.
I rewrote the bit where Pippin described Denethor's last moments several times. It's always hard to know how much to repeat of what of your readers already know when a character has to describe something he's seen to a different character. I wanted to put in enough to show not only how horrific it really had been, but also to slip in the 'ragged upstart' bits, to remind the reader that if Denethor's servants were devoted to his cause, they would think of Aragorn as not quite legitimate as well.
I know some people think Denethor ‘slipped slowly into madness’ – I do not. I believe these words meant the madness came that night…’And as he watched, it seemed to him that Denethor grew old before his eyes…’
But who would have told Aragorn that? After the fact, wouldn't it have been far more likely anyone who had gone with the army to the Black Gate, who were the only ones available to ask, would have said something like, "oh, yes, Denethor hadn't been himself lately." or "He hid it well, but I thought he started acting a bit odd after Boromir left."
Aragorn's trying to give Brithnir the benefit of the doubt here.
I'm glad you enjoyed it, in spite of the differing interpretations. And thank you for the very detailed comments!
Garnet Took
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
Oh, Poor Pippin. He's going to feel just awful when he finally wakes up.
This was a very good story. Ver detaled and full of well-drawn characters.
I have wondered at times whether Denethor's former servants would have issues with serving the new king, and whether they had any regrets over their actiions on that fateful night.
Author's reply
I think they only way someone could live with themselves after abetting Denethor would be to take no personal responsibility for what happened and be proud of their ability to follow orders. I didn't want to write Denethor's servants as tortured by their acts, because I wanted the contrast to Hithdol.
Thank you very much for your kind comments.
Tigger
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I drop a very deep and respectful curtsey in your direction m'dear. This was a masterfully written tale on a portion of the story I often wonder about. I loved how Aragorn was able to bring Brithnír down to size and also got him thinking about blind obdedience. Pippin was correct as well. At the moment, the group of the retainers together could do nothing but preen and brag, but as time went on, they would be a powerful group to foster...*something* in the Citadel. Aragorn needed to know about that and who else would tell him in these early days?
Poor Pippin though to have all of that guilt lying on his heart. I'm glad he was finally able to talk to Aragorn about it and through that, was able to let Aragorn know what *really* happened that night. The truth will set you free and in this case, it also set free Beregond. It also let a horrible weight come off of our little Knight's shoulders as well.
Although what a price Pippin will have to pay for it. When I read that little note at the end of the story, I let out a groan. While I am no drinker, I do have family members that are and I've seen the aftereffects of drinking too much too fast. Poor Pip.
This was a fantastic take on a portion of the story I don't see tackled too often. Thanks for sharing it w/us!! :o)
Author's reply
well, blush, and thank you. It was a very difficult story to write and I'm pleased that I seem to have made these men believable.
I, too, sympathize with Pippin. There was a - well, I'd say memorable but I wish I could remember more of it - party where I drank a few glasses of a spicy honey flavored drink I thought was wine but it turned out to be liqueur. I'd been quite normal then it hit really hard all of a sudden. Don't they say to 'write what you know'? LOL
Thanks for your comments!
Amy
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I adore Jeeves, and Bunter even more, so I love Hithdol the perfect servant. I love stories about Aragorn getting settled in the city right after his coronation.
Pippin's lovely in this, so loyal and true to Aragorn and Beregond and Faramir.
I like it when Aragorn loses his patience with Brithnir and cuts to the chase.
And just a great scene when Aragorn suggests taking Pippin to his bed. The rumor mill seems to surprise him, silly man!
Author's reply
Thank you. I could not resist putting in the joke at the end once the incongruity of it all hit me.
I think he assumed the rumor mill would have been focusing on who he was going to pick as Queen.
Oh, yes, Bunter. I'm with Harriet, I do love him!
Glad you enjoyed the story and thank you for the comments.
Dreamflower
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
I absolutely love this! Pippin, loyal, valiant and determined--and astute and intelligent; something often neglected in fic. Aragorn, wise and compassionate, and slightly confused as he makes his way through his first few days as King. And the two servants: what a contrast in attitude and personality. It was clear that Brithnir had not thought through all the implications of his "obedience" that night, though he might well have grieved Lord Denethor's death. Perhaps if *Hithdol* had been the servant in charge that night Denethor *would* have lived, as well as Faramir...
An excellent and thought-provoking story!
Author's reply
I don't think Brithnir had the habit of thinking much at all. He just did what he was told, what he had always done, and probably very well or Denethor would not have kept him around. Trying to figure out what kind of person- without making him too stupid, crazy, drugged or under other nefarious influences - could have done what he did was very difficult.
I don't think of Aragorn as much confused as overwhelmed. He had six weeks or so to get a grip on the military aspects of post-War Gondor, but all the internal and many of the diplomatic issues must have been dumped on him all at once once he was crowned.
Pippin had done a lot of growing up lately. I don't think it precludes him still being a happy, fun loving sort of person, but he certainly was no longer a child in any sense. I think JRRT drew him as impulsive, but neither stupid nor clumsy nor careless of honor.
Thank you for your comments. I'm glad you enjoyed the story.
Larner
· 10 July 2007
· Chapter 1: Circumstantial Heroes
My take on this was a bit different, but this is marvelous, Gwynnyd. Very well done, and the characterizations and contrasts between the two servants are superb.
Very nice.
Author's reply
Thank you so much. I'd made up Hithdol for an earlier story, and he seemed such a contrast to what we saw of Denethor's servants. I couldn't see Aragorn wanting someone who would hand a torch to a suicidal madman around him,but you can't actually punish a servant for following orders,so they must have still been around.
I'm glad you enjoyed the story.